Thailand Expats

Wellington · #1 29-11-2005, 18:51

Surely I'm not alone in noticing over the last three years here
that when Honda announce a "NEW" vehicle, Toyota are waiting in the wings to introduce an identical rival(apart the badge) at an identical price too. AND vice versa.
Is this just coincidence or does Toyota own Honda/or vice versa!

And what really annoys ,is that we cannot get cars such as the Civic 2 door hatch or the Yaris or the new ,fabulously sleek new 8th generation Civic first shown at the Frankfurt Motor Show in July this year.
Why is Thailand left with the dregs from both manufacturers and then fobbed off with the ridiculously "NON NEW" Civic shown in Phuket this last week and trumpeted as the NEW ALL NEW Civic. Rubbish.

stevem · #2 30-11-2005, 05:27

Quite simple really. The car manufacturers are still adjusting to Thailand and the boom in car sales. Years ago it was not such a great market. Things are changing.

Look at the Toyota Vigo, great car by the way, was first available in Thailand September last year, only went on sale in Australia a few months ago. So who is behind???

LivinLOS · #3 30-11-2005, 15:33

Same with the D-Max.. Out in Thailand for ages before it was in UK (and US IIRC)..

Also here is about 12k GBP and back in blighty its nearer 20 I heard..

eric-the-viking · #4 03-12-2005, 07:31

honda city
cracking small car ,never seen it in the uk .
D max your only just starting to see them on the roads in the uk , other wise its the mitsubishi ll200 or nissan navara or ford ranger .all starting new at about £16500

Denver · #5 05-12-2005, 20:59

Just seen a Nissan Cedric out here!! Looked a million years old and still running which is good but what the hell is going on with that name!

Cedric!

LivinLOS · #6 05-12-2005, 21:17

Odd thing is that I have seen the new civics advertised on Thai TV..

I am guessing they just tried to flog you old stock and clear inventory rather then 'its not available in Thailand'...

jojo78 · #7 11-12-2005, 22:45

New Civic was out mid November. Yes it is the new 8th gen Civic.

The Toyota Yaris will be out early next year.

Honda and Toyota are not in cahoots. Both companies are fighting it out to be the top seller in the saloon market, although Toyota will always outsell Honda in Thailand due to Toyota's pickup truck sales and Bangkok taxis.

Thailand is not left with the dregs. Both Honda and Toyota have invested heavily in Thailand. Honda has built its R&D centre for Asia in Ayudhya.

Wellington · #8 14-12-2005, 11:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by jojo78

New Civic was out mid November. Yes it is the new 8th gen Civic.

The Toyota Yaris will be out early next year.

Honda and Toyota are not in cahoots. Both companies are fighting it out to be the top seller in the saloon market, although Toyota will always outsell Honda in Thailand due to Toyota's pickup truck sales and Bangkok taxis.

Thailand is not left with the dregs. Both Honda and Toyota have invested heavily in Thailand. Honda has built its R&D centre for Asia in Ayudhya.

Maybe,but the NEW CIVIC I refer to was the concept car introduced at The Geneva Show in March
The "new" civic introduced in Thailand last month is just a patch up of the old model and no-way resembles the new design, which I suspect will be held back from the Thai market for a couple of years and we are being fobbed of with a new model which IS NOT NEW>>>>>>>>>>look at The BAngkok Post of 29th July this year.
So we are stillleft with the dregs
?Do you workfor Honda maybe

LivinLOS · #9 14-12-2005, 11:25

The 8th Gen new civic is not just a patch up.. Very different car... This is the same car as sold on other global markets..

Any concept car shown at motor shows usually has much revision and changes before reaching the market if at all.. Also make your mind up.. Frankfurt or Geneva ?? March or July ?? (BTW Frankfurt usually comes in Sept if my memory has not slipped)...

LivinLOS · #10 14-12-2005, 11:28

Seems like late 06 is predicted for the civic coupe / Hatch based simiolar to this concept..

http://www.autoweek.com/files/specia...ic/pages/1.htm

Wellington · #11 14-12-2005, 16:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivinLOS

The 8th Gen new civic is not just a patch up.. Very different car... This is the same car as sold on other global markets..

Any concept car shown at motor shows usually has much revision and changes before reaching the market if at all.. Also make your mind up.. Frankfurt or Geneva ?? March or July ?? (BTW Frankfurt usually comes in Sept if my memory has not slipped)...

I did not mean to nit-pick, The new Honda was seen at both Geneva and Frankfurt, and you will see a review of the car in this weeks Bangkok Post Motoring Section
I have to continue to disagree though; the "NEW" Civic we saw announced in Phuket last month IS a patch up to keep the Asean Market quiet until they see the REAL new Civic, if you are correct, next year.
But tell me why we NEVER saw the superb 2 door Civic Hatch which has been selling in Europe for 3 years, and is streets ahead of the current 3 box Civic.
This was the point I was trying to make..........Honda keeps feeding Thailand the old ,dated cars and lets the best go elsewhere.
So does Toyota..The Yaris has been on sale in the UK for 5 years.
And you do not have any comment on why the two manufacturers sell their models at almost identical prices.

stevem · #12 14-12-2005, 16:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wellington

Honda keeps feeding Thailand the old ,dated cars and lets the best go elsewhere.
So does Toyota..The Yaris has been on sale in the UK for 5 years.

I'm sure that they do that because they are playing to what the market dictates, or that they see what they can sell into the market.

LivinLOS · #13 14-12-2005, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wellington

I did not mean to nit-pick, The new Honda was seen at both Geneva and Frankfurt, and you will see a review of the car in this weeks Bangkok Post Motoring Section

The car shown at both those motor shows was a concept car.. This was a car that is not for sale anywhere in the world and not for sale in that form ever.. Concepts are put out to gauge reaction or give hints of future styling themes across brand etc..

The Civic concept is apparently 'close' tpo the final design car but as its not in production I doubt that tyou will see a review of the car shown at geneva in the BKK post..

Quote:

I have to continue to disagree though; the "NEW" Civic we saw announced in Phuket last month IS a patch up to keep the Asean Market quiet until they see the REAL new Civic, if you are correct, next year.

Well I dont know about the 2 door but the 4 door and STi version are what for sale in Euro markets.. a totally new civic.. also rumours of a CRX model around the same parts line..

Quote:

But tell me why we NEVER saw the superb 2 door Civic Hatch which has been selling in Europe for 3 years, and is streets ahead of the current 3 box Civic.

Thailand has massive import duties for cars and a sliding scale where asean cars are cheaper than other import regions (seen the price of a Beemer or Merc ??)

So Honda Thailand probably did a cost evaluation on retooling for what is basically a budget value car.. I am guessing the Thai market didnt make retooling factories worthwhile..

Quote:

This was the point I was trying to make..........Honda keeps feeding Thailand the old ,dated cars and lets the best go elsewhere.
So does Toyota..The Yaris has been on sale in the UK for 5 years.
And you do not have any comment on why the two manufacturers sell their models at almost identical prices.

Thats rediculous.. Toyota and Honda are fighting tooth and nail for market share.. I suspect comparitive prices are a fact of price competition rather than price collusion.. If one was far more expensive it would undersell the other in a competative price sensative market like Thailand..

LivinLOS · #14 14-12-2005, 16:50

and what Toyota and Honda are identical ??

There are no shared inventory or design work that I know of.. Honda and Rover did it.. Honda and Acura is essentially to appeal to USA brand concious consumers.. The Chevvy pick up out currently is a badge clone.. Obviously Kia bought many Lotus designs and production rights (the Asian build Elan is embarassingly better built than its far more expensive British built brother)..

Basically this does happen in the market sometimes but I dont know of it ever happening with toyota and honda..

Wellington · #15 15-12-2005, 17:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivinLOS

and what Toyota and Honda are identical ??

There are no shared inventory or design work that I know of.. Honda and Rover did it.. Honda and Acura is essentially to appeal to USA brand concious consumers.. The Chevvy pick up out currently is a badge clone.. Obviously Kia bought many Lotus designs and production rights (the Asian build Elan is embarassingly better built than its far more expensive British built brother)..

Basically this does happen in the market sometimes but I dont know of it ever happening with toyota and honda..

This can go rolling on
O.K........near enough identical/engine size/performance/body size & shape
Civic/Corolla...........priced the same.
And I suggest you look in The Bangkok Post's web site and find the motoring pages for last week........You will find the car I'm talking about....reviewed.

LivinLOS · #16 15-12-2005, 17:24

I actually saw it in a car mag last night.. Odd as I read mid 06 for the sales but must have been brought forward..

so you will soon be able to buy it.. whats your problem ??? Just wait a while until its stocked..

Wellington · #17 16-12-2005, 10:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivinLOS

I actually saw it in a car mag last night.. Odd as I read mid 06 for the sales but must have been brought forward..

so you will soon be able to buy it.. whats your problem ??? Just wait a while until its stocked..

I can see no future in this argument

I was going to buy the Mazda Three Sport Hatch anyway,when I sell my CRV.

marc26 · #18 16-12-2005, 13:06

There are no shared inventory or design work that I know of.. Honda and Rover did it.. Honda and Acura is essentially to appeal to USA brand concious consumers..

i dont know if they have it anywhere else:

Ifiniti is nissan's luxury model
Acura is Honda's luxury model
Lexus is Toyota's luxury model

in Infiniti and especially Lexus', the models are exactly the same, but just more luxurious.
Acura's models are completely different from Honda's model, except one SUV.

by the way, for a cheap car, i dont think you can go wrong with a Honda Civic

jojo78 · #19 16-12-2005, 13:56

Trouble is the Civic isn't that cheap anymore.

For the 2 litre auto, you could just add a little bit more and get an Accord.

To Wellington, the Civic on sale here in Phuket is the new 8th gen Civic. I don't understand how you can say otherwise. Go to the Honda showroom in Phuket Town and take a look. Not an awful lot of resemblance to the previous model.

The Civic hatch isn't available in Asia, not just ASEAN.

The Civic Coupe does look very nice though, should be out middle of 2006.

Benjy · #20 16-12-2005, 13:58

"Acura's models are completely different from Honda's model, except one SUV."

They are all just Honda's but the USA rebadges the higher end ones / sporty ones because Americans traditionally didnt want to spend X money on just a honda.

LivinLOS · #21 16-12-2005, 14:13

Yeah Pauls post confuses me too.. Cause Lexus although being Toyota with a new brand does not sell the lexus's elsewhere in the world with the toyota badge.. Like you cant get an LS300 coupe or LS400 saloon with toyota badging..

But with Acura and Honda all of the acuras I saw in the states came out as simply hondas in the UK.. CRX, NSX (superb car BTW.. Drove one once and it was tight as a teenager) etc..

I had a couple of CRX's when I was young and before I wanted rear wheel drive sports cars.. They consistantly impressed me and the VTEC was a stunner..

Wellington · #22 16-12-2005, 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivinLOS

Yeah Pauls post confuses me too.. Cause Lexus although being Toyota with a new brand does not sell the lexus's elsewhere in the world with the toyota badge.. Like you cant get an LS300 coupe or LS400 saloon with toyota badging..

But with Acura and Honda all of the acuras I saw in the states came out as simply hondas in the UK.. CRX, NSX (superb car BTW.. Drove one once and it was tight as a teenager) etc..

I had a couple of CRX's when I was young and before I wanted rear wheel drive sports cars.. They consistantly impressed me and the VTEC was a stunner..

The HARRIER is a Lexus with a TOYOTA badge

The VTEC is an engine ,so I hope you had a car around it.

LivinLOS · #23 16-12-2005, 17:55

Do they make a Toyota Harrier then in some markets ?? Cause thats my point although Toyota make Lexus cars they are usually Lexus only brand (LS400 for example) without a toyota equivalent car.. Whereas Honda sell the idental car as a honda in the UK and a acura in the states.. nothing about the car different (emissions and localisation) except the badge..

As to the VTEC as stated.. I had a few CRX's the Honda CRX 1.6 VTEC was a superb little machine.. Really reliable, pretty econimical, nippy and lightweight.. Shame front wheel drive only as once you get to a certain level of car control rear wheel drive is so much more satisfying when you get them sliding..

Jonas · #24 16-12-2005, 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivinLOS

As to the VTEC as stated.. I had a few CRX's the Honda CRX 1.6 VTEC was a superb little machine.. Really reliable, pretty econimical, nippy and lightweight.. Shame front wheel drive only as once you get to a certain level of car control rear wheel drive is so much more satisfying when you get them sliding..

I was always look for the CRX when i was younger !! Think it was a great car
But i ended up with buy a Prelude instead , still have it .....