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#71
09-11-2007, 06:32
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Well, it appears that I too, am suffering from a complex, ie. (everybody is out to get us americans),,,,,, I need to stop being so sensitive about things said about the US,,, NO APOLOGY NEEDED!!! If I ever perchance run into you in Phuket (MTB), the first one is on me (wouldn't want to appear rude)  (that was a try at humor)cheers!! 
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#72
09-11-2007, 10:41
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Oh yeah, Penang was affected, but just a lil bit.
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#73
09-11-2007, 12:23
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As I was reading through it I wanted to quote nearly every second post and make comments, but I chose yours Marc, because it seemed to be the most sensible of all. IMHO, it is mostly a combination of politics, media influence and envy that is the root cause of all this. As an immigrant to the US, I believe I have the ability to see the issue from at least two sides. From where I came and from where I am. The world is in a political turmoil at the moment and the US is very much in the forefront. Some agree with the politics and others disagree, but as in most conflicting situations the negative voice is always louder. Within the borders of the US politics is also polarized as ever. I am going to stop short of taking sides, however, I believe that the media has a big role in fueling all this. The net results is that people through out the world are taking sides, some for and some against ... and a few in the middle (or should I say objective). All this gets accelerated into something more personal and all of a sudden Americans are either hated or loved. Hate speaks louder than love, unfortunately. I used the word "envy" before. That does not mean that I believe that most wants to be Americans if they could, but there is IMHO an envy of the US power, which more often manifest itself as resentment, which escalate into hate. If it is not envy it may be a sense of forced submissiveness. Back when there was 2 superpowers it was easy for most people in the western world to side with America. After the fall of the Soviet Union the status quo in the US became too one-sided for many. Agreeing or disagreeing with politics it is sad that these views are brought to a personal level. I can speak first hand about this. Sometimes I introduce myself as a Dane and sometimes as an American and while most of the times it makes no difference I have several examples where the reception of ME was different depending on how I introduced my self and I find that truly sad, because I am only ONE person. Most Americans that I know, on the surface will say that they do not care what others think (making them arrogant), however, they do care. but have a conviction strong enough to simply stand up for themselves and their country. I think a perfect example of this ebb and flow relationship between France and the United States. Under Jacques Chirac most French disliked the Americans and most Americans disliked the French. Believe me I have worked for a French company from 2001 to 2007 and felt it first hand ... actually I was part of the problem. I have not voluntarily had any French wine for 4 years or as far as I had any control any French product. Now the political table it turning with Nicolas Sarkozy at the helm in France and attitudes are changing in both France and the US in a rapid pace, even I have made a decision to buy a bottle of French wine soon. This whole thing is going to turn nearly 180º solely because of politics, just like the animosity was solely political. As I said before, it is sad when we make the issue personal. Believe me I have seen the worst of people in some Americans, but as a whole I have to say that Americans are some of the most compassionate and good hearted people than I have ever met. I will go so far as to say I believe I have become a better person living here. Agree of disagree with American politics as you please. Bash or praise Bush as you like. Stereotype Americans as being fat if you choose to go that far. But please be mindful, that behind most of the 300 million people here, that some of you are painting with one brush .... there are more admirable people than you can throw a stick at. Just my very humble opinion ... feel free to throw mud at me, because like most Americans I can handle it.
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 Last edited by MrDK : 09-11-2007 at 14:02.
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#74
09-11-2007, 14:40
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Lots of valid and sensible points Lars but I dont quite understand your boycott of French products from what you write. It has to be more than political tension between th US and France? Was it more from the following difficulties working for the french company?
I have to admit that when the canteen in Capitol in Washington DC changed the name of French Fries to Freeedom Fries I had one of the biggest laughs of my life 
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#75
09-11-2007, 14:47
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As I said I was part of the problem. It is easy to get entangled in ideology.
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#76
09-11-2007, 14:59
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I guess we all can see such matters in black and white at times!! It is time for you to buy some good French wine and French cheese to go with it
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#77
09-11-2007, 15:01
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#79
09-11-2007, 15:13
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This is a cute boycot story. A few years back a female friend of mine wanted me and all her firends to boycot American products due to the American invasion of Iraq. Well, neither myself or many others followed her wishes so she was quite lonely in her boycot. Well a couple of weeks later speaking to her she admitted that she gave up the boycoy after a few days because she just HAD TO HAVE Heinz ketchup
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#81
09-11-2007, 15:24
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My mom always refused to keep ketchup in the house. She said it was an American invention to mask untasteful food.
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#82
09-11-2007, 15:38
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#84
09-11-2007, 15:42
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Havarti is the kind. Havarti - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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#85
09-11-2007, 15:44
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Point taken Tommy. I didn't really know the exact figures, as here we learn (from the media) usually that the turn up for elections in the US is by far not as big as here for e.g. our paliament elections. In my post I have just reflected the average feeling here about the USA and it's political leaders as well as some rules they have there. In Holland there is quite a large group of people, who are amazed and stereotype Amricans (again as a general statement) as very superficial and don't know much about the world outside their borders. As an example, I can say that on countless times I was asked if Holland was the capital of Amsterdam!!! Or are you from Holland in Michigan?  Since the subject is "country perceptions", we talk about perceptions and not about personal opinions. I do know quite some Americans both privatly and through work. I must say some of these perceptions are very true, but let's be honest most individual people are just great persons.
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 Operation SnowGirl will continue 
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#86
09-11-2007, 15:56
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Nah, I would say that only a French Brie can be called Brie But I will check out Havarti in the stores here since I love a good cheese!!Last edited by Tommychrk : 09-11-2007 at 15:57. Reason: Misspelling
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#87
09-11-2007, 16:00
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#89
09-11-2007, 16:27
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Wallbasher... no worries mate! I shall make sure I get the 2nd one ;-)
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#90
09-11-2007, 16:31
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MrDK... I am looking forward to a lively conversation if I get to see you in Pattaya next week ;-) I always enjoy conversations with people who have decided to live and work in another country... they tend (my perception ;-) to have a more balanced view 
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#91
09-11-2007, 20:22
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I think offence is more likely to be taken when people make an attachment between comments about their country to comments about themselves. If someone says GWB is a moron and that USA is known for obesity it doesn't by extension mean that you the reader are a fat moron, unless you make that link yourself.
Not bashing here just my observation but I think there's something in the american culture that gives you a greater tendancy to do this vs European nations (but far less so than asian ones). For all the outward confidence americans can show I think there's an insecurity there where people have placed a false sense of pride on their beliefs, choices and groups they belong to and need validation from others sharing them. So if someone takes the opposite view or says something negative it is very often viewed as a personal slight. I think this manifests itself in many ways culturally in the USA, a few examples: - not as many eccentrics vs somewhere like UK - groups like punks, goths etc being comparatively mainstream - politically, where many people take things to the extreme where they HATE Bush, Hillary, Dems or the Reps - in news media a very strange situation where it's almost like a war between two sides - frequent grouping of threats/enemies Us VS Them - communists, terrorists, liberals, immigrants - socially on issues like abortion, drugs, gay marriage where it's not enough to have individual choice - people want bans for everyone or from the opposing side they object to those things being "forced" upon them - celebrity worship - like in Top Gear (UK TV show) the presenters road-trip through Alabama with "Nascar sucks" on their car and get chased out of town! Again it needs to be said what people see as trends in a country doesn't mean they apply to specific individuals. Just to turn things to the subject of Thailand you can take what I wrote above and the same thing would apply but multiplied by a factor of 10.
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#92
09-11-2007, 21:04
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Very good post Brit IMHO. I hav |