Thai Smoking Ban takes Effect Feb 11th

[Dodger]

Why are you continually missing the point i am trying to make. I am not suggesting you should have smoke blown in your face, but am against the government telling every person, that from such and such a date they will allow no smoking in any public establishment.

That gives me NO CHOICE, to go for a beer or a meal and stay inside that premises and enjoy a cigarette. I am trying my hardest to say, if they gave the owner of the separate businesses, not all public places, just bars and restaurants a choice rather than making a law, with fines etc for breaking it, then if he advertised his premises was non smoking, we could go there together, only I could not smoke, but then I would have chosen to go there and accepted it was a non smoking establishment, just as I do on public transport.

Your choice to not be exposed to toxic fumes is accetable, so you would not go to a bar that allowed smoking, but we would then both have choices of where to go. When they bring in these total non smoking bans, not all of us are then left with a choice, you are suggesting, that because I like to smoke I should stay at home to do it, get real?? what social choice is that??

Smoking is not illegal, after asking you twice already, tell me why they have not outlawed it? its so repugnant, its creates so many toxic fumes, I explained to you regarding the explosion in numbers of propane outdoor heaters effecting our world's environment, but heck lets ignore this because your preferance is not to be exposed to a cigarettes smoke!!! but your preferance ignores mine, is that equitable???

Also how much is cigarette smoking affecting your health as a non smoker? compare that to all other toxic fumes, from factories, car exhausts, gases, how much does alcohol affect your health? high fat diets? some of these things are illegal, why not put the same resources into policing illegal dumping or minimising toxic factory fumes??

You will end up paying a lot more in either tax or increased costs, because of lost tobacco taxation revenue's, unfortnately I cannot put that into an individual amount, but reckon if i came round and asked you to pay the said sum, plus the cost of its collection and administration, you might just come down a little and agree on a very basic point I'm trying to make, let me have a place sociably I can go and enjoy a drink with my smoking friends and others who accept a smokey environment, and stop all this big brother state telling me what I can or cannot do everywhere in the country I live in!!

[ub2yoo]

...phew..after all that reading, I think I need a ciggy now

[Nautilus]

Originally Posted by ub2yoo

...phew..after all that reading, I think I need a ciggy now

555, i already had a couple of beers and smokes after reading the hot debate. Nice to read though.

[dbaron]

I agree with Dodger.
Feck governments telling us what to do and continue to collect revenue from our habits.
Feck do gooders telling us not to smoke when they drink themselves into a stuper and harm themselves anyway.
And feck you who tell us to stay at home to smoke when you could also stay home in your airconditioned comfort without telling us to stay home and smoke.
You may be able to smell your ares instead of our smoke. ( pleasent don't you think ).
You may also by staying home avoid car and bike fumes etc.
Grow up you preachers of non smoking you are already breathing far worse every time you walk out the door.
Maybe you should wrap yourselves in cotton wool and when you drop dead from overweight or heart attack from your habits we should ask for a ban on the food you eat and a lack of excercise for fat cnuts.

DB

[Matt Knickerbox]

In go go bars you have gonorrhea dancing like 10 feet in front of you, but there is little to no regulation on STD testing. Instead authorities are more concerned with smoking in bars.
They banned smoking in Makati, Phils all the gogos decided to build like smoking friendly isolation chambers for the bars. Or they would give you an inconspicuous ashtray (Coke can). For when the police bust in looking to give out tickets.

For the record smoking should be handled by individual business owners, however people allow their governments to make decisions for themselves.
There are such things as “exhaust systems” that can remove foul air from facilities they are pretty neat.
Every problem encounters itself with a solution.

[marc26]

Originally Posted by dbaron

I agree with Dodger.
Feck governments telling us what to do and continue to collect revenue from our habits.
Feck do gooders telling us not to smoke when they drink themselves into a stuper and harm themselves anyway.
And feck you who tell us to stay at home to smoke when you could also stay home in your airconditioned comfort without telling us to stay home and smoke.
You may be able to smell your ares instead of our smoke. ( pleasent don't you think ).
You may also by staying home avoid car and bike fumes etc.
Grow up you preachers of non smoking you are already breathing far worse every time you walk out the door.
Maybe you should wrap yourselves in cotton wool and when you drop dead from overweight or heart attack from your habits we should ask for a ban on the food you eat and a lack of excercise for fat cnuts.

DB

since you put it this way, ill repsond in kind

but we are not imposing a disgusting and filthy habit on you!!
by me sitting and drinking a beer, i am not ruining your meal
to be completely honest with you, i think smokers are some of the most ignorant, selfish people i have ever met

you would rather ruin a paying customers meal to enjoy your addictive habit than step outside and let other people enjoy the meal they paid for?
sounds pretty damn selfish to me

[marc26]

Originally Posted by Dodger

then if he advertised his premises was non smoking, we could go there together, only I could not smoke, but then I would have chosen to go there and accepted it was a non smoking establishment, just as I do on public transport


!!

i will respond to you in a better manner because although we disagree you have beena gentleman about it

but by allowing smoking, it is not giving non-smokers a chance at all
how is that fair to us?

for example. one restaurant makes the best curry in the world
if it is non-smoking, you can still make a choice to go and eat that curry and not smoke
if it is smoking, it basically doesnt allow me to go eat that wonderful curry

[ototto]

Just wonder what the indian and arab restaurants that offer shisha hookahs pipes will do.

I'm wondering also about discos such as Tiger, Taipan, etc...

And what about Lolita's ?

[jimholio]

I quit smoking about 7 months ago, and even before that i only smoke together with alchohol. So i guess i understand both sides its very nice to have those cancer sticks along with the liver killers but on the other side when you dont smoke yourself it can be rather annoying.

Another fact is that once Sweden started enforcing this law ALOT of people stopped smoking and thats a good thing isnt it?

Im not against this law i think its great, because now i no longer have to smell like an ashtray after going to the pub.

[faultytowers]

To me , it is a case of governments telling individuals what they can and cannot do in properties that they own.

Civil/government building are different but if someone owns a bar/restuarant/hotel then why can they not decide for themselves if they wish to allow something legal to be permitted in their premises. Surely from a money making point of view a businessman would weigh up the pro's and con's of allowing smoking and make his decision based on whether it would be profitable to allow/ban smoking.

If "staff health" was a concern then inform anyone wishing to work there that smoking is allowed and then it is their choice if they wish to work in that environment.


P.S My "Medical Head" says smoking is a bad habit and cigarettes should be classed as an illegal substance .........but as a smoker I say it's a matter of personal choice.

[marc26]

by the way
i am seeing the same thing in these threads that i saw when NYC implemented their smoking ban
people arguing their beliefs and cases and once it went through, there were no problems
i heard from smokers that they actually liked it and didnt mind going outside to smoke

[zarf]

The word that keeps cropping up is choice, the pro smokers are arguing that they should be allowed the choice of smoking or not, big brother should not lay down the law.
What about non smokers? we don't have the choice whether we have to cough and hack with the rest or stink like an ashtray! Smoking is a practice that kills both the smoker and non smoker so how can a freedom of choice argument be used?
I reckon the banning in enclosed spaces is the right way to do it, as banning it totally would be nonsensical when c****** is being downgraded and alcohol is still legal.

You go out with a group of friends enjoying a chat, every so often two or three of them get up and go outside to smoke, breaking the ambiance, breaking the fun you had all thought you'd have together,


hardly....you go to the toilet, up for a round, chat to people out with the group.

large crowds of smokers congreating outside bars in the Temple Bar area of Dublin, it led to a massive increase in violence on the streets, a much larger scale than experienced before the ban was implemented.

i think the drink would be more the reason and the people involved would be of the 'eejit ' variety.

I appreciate that people like to smoke but others don't...are the new laws really so bad?

[pablo]

Can a member light up a butt, at a hash event?

(a friend wanted to know....not me) 5555

[Iltis]

here in switzerland lots of restaurants have a smoking and a non-smoking section. imo this works fine here... smokers can go to the smoking section for a smoke and it seems that everybody is happy with that around here...

[dawsey]

hehe Time for my 2 cents worth on smoking in public places. As a smoker myself, it annoyed the hell out of me not to be able to spark up in a pub(or restaurant) here in England.
But I agree with ATM and Marc26 totally Dodger, you put your point across very well, but it appears that smokers are now in a minority, and we should be thinking of the health and welfare of the majority now. I understand your annoyance, I had it too, but I understand the reasoning behind it. It is an unhealthy and filthy habit that shouldn't be imposed on non-smokers despite what smokers think. We have to get used to the idea of huddling outside in all kinds of weather to enjoy our vice.

On another related aside, did you know the UK gov are seriously thinking of banning drivers from smoking in their own cars? Utter madness IMO unless there are objecting passengers or children with you. This is the way the world is going now, do gooders and nanny state thinking imposing their rules on everybody. But in the case first discussed, smoking in a pub or restaurant I have to agree with the non smokers.

[marc26]

you know whats funny
here in the states, the girls have sort of taken this smoking outside like when they go to the toilet
they actually like going outside and gossipping

[marc26]

funny story on NYC smoking ban

the 1st night it was ever imposed, i was out at an industry party
it was a Friday night and we went out real late after

that Monday morning, i wake up and forgot to get my dry cleaning so i figured since people werent smoking in bar i could re-wear my shirt from Friday night

as im sitting in work a colleauge asked what was on back of my shirt
it was BBQ sauce!!!
i then remembered getting a kebab on the street before a taxi at 5am
how the hell i got the BBQ sauce on back of my shirt i have no clue 55555

[faultytowers]

Originally Posted by dawsey

This is the way the world is going now, do gooders and nanny state thinking imposing their rules on everybody. But in the case first discussed, smoking in a pub or restaurant I have to agree with the non smokers.

That was the point of my post , not so much the "smoking ban" but the fact that "the powers that be " can dictate what you can /cannot do within the confines of a property which you own (bar/restaurant etc) even though it is not illegal.

Funny final point , prisoners are exempt from these rules because ......
......... it would breach their "human rights" !!!!!

[dawsey]

Originally Posted by faultytowers

Funny final point , prisoners are exempt from these rules because ......
......... it would breach their "human rights" !!!!!

Added to the fact that they would have to deal with very p1ssed off prisoners. Cue rioting and extra hassle for government officials !

[Dupree00]

People ask why the government should be allowed to ban smoking. Follow the money. The reason could be healthcare costs. How much does the government pay (with our tax revenues) for the people that can’t afford to pay for medical treatment? There is also a loss of productivity when people are sick. It’s a much bigger picture than someone being annoyed by smokers. The ban can promote a healthier society overall.

Second Hand Smoke (SHS) exposure has been linked to many Child and Adult Diseases and Disorders. For example, SHS:

Increases the development and progression of Asthma. Also triggers Asthma attacks

Increases Chronic Throat infections

Lung Cancer

Heart Disease

Impaired lung function

Irritated, burning, watering, itchy eyes

Upper respiratory infections

Impairs the healing process, ie: Colds last longer, infections harder to treat, prolongs illnesses

Irritates and burns nasal passages

Increases runny noses, coughing, irritates sinuses

Noxious Odors (It just plain stinks)

Increases allergies

As far as giving the choice to a bar/restaurant owner, I would think smokers would lose out. I imagine smoking is on a steady decline and an owner would be aware of this demographic. The solution is smoke clubs. Might be a good business opportunity for all you entrepreneurs.

[dawsey]

Originally Posted by Dupree00

People ask why the government should be allowed to ban smoking. Follow the money. The reason could be healthcare costs. How much does the government pay (with our tax revenues) for the people that can’t afford to pay for medical treatment? There is also a loss of productivity when people are sick. It’s a much bigger picture than someone being annoyed by smokers. The ban can promote a healthier society overall.

If there was a total ban on smoking in the UK, the government would have to raise our income taxes to cover the £billions lost in tobacco revenue. The amount spent on tobacco related illnesses is minute compared to the tobacco revenue.

Originally Posted by Dupree00

As far as giving the choice to a bar/restaurant owner, I would think smokers would lose out. I imagine smoking is on a steady decline and an owner would be aware of this demographic. The solution is smoke clubs. Might be a good business opportunity for all you entrepreneurs.

Wouldn't work here. Absolutely no chance of getting a licence to run a venue that promotes or allows smoking. Dead in the water.

[Dupree00]

Originally Posted by dawsey

If there was a total ban on smoking in the UK, the government would have to raise our income taxes to cover the £billions lost in tobacco revenue. The amount spent on tobacco related illnesses is minute compared to the tobacco revenue.:

I was talking about the ban on smoking in bars/restaurants in LOS. A total ban on drinking was proven ridiculous in the US Prohibition days.

Originally Posted by dawsey

Wouldn't work here. Absolutely no chance of getting a licence to run a venue that promotes or allows smoking. Dead in the water.

Again, in LOS anything is possible with the right amount of influence and grea$e.