Some things I have learned along the way

[Sir Burr]

Have been checking out this forum and have been looking at a few of the threads. Seems that most of the posters don't live in the LOS, but try to get here as often as they can.
I have lived in Phuket for twenty years and have been in SE Asia for twenty four years. I arrived when I was twenty-two and am now nearly fourty-seven.
I was a monger until I was thirty-nine. Here are a few things I picked up on the way:-

1. Too many people think that because thay have been here X amount of years, that they know more than somebody who has been here less time.
This is absolute crap. I had a friend that stayed in Phuket. After three years, he knew every influential Thai on the island from the governer down. He could also speak better Thai than me, knew all the best restaurants and was first with the local goings on.

2. Learn some spoken Thai. You will get more respect and admiration. Things will become cheaper as their are four prices for most things. They are for:- Local Phuket people, other Thais, farangs that speak Thai, all other farangs.

3. If you do decide to marry a Thai, don't wait too long.
Once you are in your forties and your looks are going and your flesh starts heading south, it will become more and more likely that a girl will stay with you for one reason only. Money. If you are happy with that, fine.

4. The advice of not marrying a bar-girl is generally true, though there are plenty of exceptions (me for example). The success rate of BG / farang marriages is maybe one in five. If you take the girl back to your country, the odds get even worse. If you move to Thailand the odds get better. Thais are like fine wines, in general, they don't travel well.
Also, most of the sucessful marriages are not with the stunners. They are far too up themselves and too selfish to make a marriage work.

5. You will never understand in full the idea of "face". This idea runs through the whole of Thai society and more often than not, dictates Thai peoples thoughts and actions. The whole idea of face is to glue Thai society together. Cohesion and consensus is valued more than truth.
The longer I stay here, the more I'm convinced that I know bugger all.

6. Even if you are seething with anger, never show it if you are dealing with Thai people. If you do, you will lose their respect and the problem will just get bigger. Keep smiling and use a soft voice (yes, I know this is virtually impossible at times).

7. Never sacrifice your future for the present. There are two types of farang that live in Thailand. Those that will be here for as long as they want, and those that will be forced home through lack of money. I have had close friends that have had to go back to the UK after staying in Phuket for twelve years or more. Once they are back, they don't adjust well.
It takes an awful lot of money to stay in Phuket. Don't sell up the home and make the permanent move to Thailand. If you fail and have to go home, at best you will have a big hole in your CV which employers don't like; at worst you will be too old to get a good job. Getting old is bad enough, being old AND poor is unthinkable. Better to keep making money in your home country and retire here when you have enough. US$400,000 would be the absolute minimum.

8. Thailand is like an ice-berg. What you see is only 10%. The other 90% is not visible.

9. Have fun, party hard, you only live once.

[LivinLOS]

Every point bang on the nail...

Looking forward to that drink..

[void]

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

Here are a few things I picked up on the way:

Thanks for the post, and welcome to the board. I am also fairly new to this board. I lived in SEAsia for much less than your self (3 in SEAsia, of which 2 were in Thailand). I have also lived in different non SEAsia countries, changing locations (where I lived) quite often.

I also thought your observations were "spot on" and per your subject, I too learned some things along the way (even though I was in SEAsia for a much shorter time).

One thing (amongst many things) of the fundamental things I learned during my 3 years in SEAsia was more about myself. In particular I learned a lot about my morals.

In the west, to a certain extent my morals were dictacted by what the "law" could easily enforce, and in the area of the west where I lived, that served as a "guideline". Being fairly conservative, I never ventured into the border-line areas of the law.

In SEAsia, I found my morals were dictated by within myself, as the SEAsia moral borderline was in a different location. Not better, not worse, but different. Sometimes the activities that one could easily do in SEAsia, were not an area that I wanted to explore. That reluctance on my part was a surprise to me, as for the first time I realized my morals were not strictly dictated by that of the common law. I learned something fundamental about myself, and it surprised me.

Of course, this is all relative to me and my path to learning about myself, and for sure it doesn't apply to everyone. And also, for certain, absolutes dont' necessarily apply when reviewing the above.

Anyway, I diverge and ramble. Welcome to phuket-info.com.

[urtheman]

Spot on Sir Burr

Kudos to you!

Cheers!

[river]

Excellent post Sir Burr, very wise words indeed.

[khon kaen boy]

All very true especially number 5

[Sir Burr]

Originally Posted by khon kaen boy

All very true especially number 5

And especially the last line of number 5.

[khon kaen boy]

yeah I actually meant the last line, sorry

[Nicke]

Great post Sir Burr and welcome to the forum.

Many valid points you pinpointed.

[nanaplaza]

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

Have been checking out this forum and have been looking at a few of the threads. Seems that most of the posters don't live in the LOS, but try to get here as often as they can.
I have lived in Phuket for twenty years and have been in SE Asia for twenty four years. I arrived when I was twenty-two and am now nearly fourty-seven.
I was a monger until I was thirty-nine. Here are a few things I picked up on the way:-

1. Too many people think that because thay have been here X amount of years, that they know more than somebody who has been here less time.
This is absolute crap. I had a friend that stayed in Phuket. After three years, he knew every influential Thai on the island from the governer down. He could also speak better Thai than me, knew all the best restaurants and was first with the local goings on.

2. Learn some spoken Thai. You will get more respect and admiration. Things will become cheaper as their are four prices for most things. They are for:- Local Phuket people, other Thais, farangs that speak Thai, all other farangs.

3. If you do decide to marry a Thai, don't wait too long.
Once you are in your forties and your looks are going and your flesh starts heading south, it will become more and more likely that a girl will stay with you for one reason only. Money. If you are happy with that, fine.

4. The advice of not marrying a bar-girl is generally true, though there are plenty of exceptions (me for example). The success rate of BG / farang marriages is maybe one in five. If you take the girl back to your country, the odds get even worse. If you move to Thailand the odds get better. Thais are like fine wines, in general, they don't travel well.
Also, most of the sucessful marriages are not with the stunners. They are far too up themselves and too selfish to make a marriage work.

5. You will never understand in full the idea of "face". This idea runs through the whole of Thai society and more often than not, dictates Thai peoples thoughts and actions. The whole idea of face is to glue Thai society together. Cohesion and consensus is valued more than truth.
The longer I stay here, the more I'm convinced that I know bugger all.

6. Even if you are seething with anger, never show it if you are dealing with Thai people. If you do, you will lose their respect and the problem will just get bigger. Keep smiling and use a soft voice (yes, I know this is virtually impossible at times).

7. Never sacrifice your future for the present. There are two types of farang that live in Thailand. Those that will be here for as long as they want, and those that will be forced home through lack of money. I have had close friends that have had to go back to the UK after staying in Phuket for twelve years or more. Once they are back, they don't adjust well.
It takes an awful lot of money to stay in Phuket. Don't sell up the home and make the permanent move to Thailand. If you fail and have to go home, at best you will have a big hole in your CV which employers don't like; at worst you will be too old to get a good job. Getting old is bad enough, being old AND poor is unthinkable. Better to keep making money in your home country and retire here when you have enough. US$400,000 would be the absolute minimum.

8. Thailand is like an ice-berg. What you see is only 10%. The other 90% is not visible.

9. Have fun, party hard, you only live once.

Thank you so much for your wisdom / experienced about life in Thailand. There is no better description then what you have wrote. I totally agreed with you and thank you so much again for your advice. Would you ever considered coming back home to your homeland? Are you married now? Is going to bars/clubs still a desirable thing for you to do now? And if you do, are you doing the BOOM BOOM regularly with different BGs/TGs ?

[Sir Burr]

Originally Posted by nanaplaza

Thank you so much for your wisdom / experienced about life in Thailand. There is no better description then what you have wrote. I totally agreed with you and thank you so much again for your advice. Would you ever considered coming back home to your homeland? Are you married now? Is going to bars/clubs still a desirable thing for you to do now? And if you do, are you doing the BOOM BOOM regularly with different BGs/TGs ?

Thanks to all for the very warm welcome that everybody has given me. Hope to meet a few of you in the not too distant future.

If I was an Aussie, Kiwi, Canadian or from the USA, then yes, I might think about going home. But, I'm from the UK, and more to the point, from a faceless suburb of London. Not only is there really nothing to go back to, but, I couldn't afford to live there anyway. I really don't know how anybody on normal pay can survive in the UK. House prices are insane, taxes are outrageous and I think society is going to hell in a hand-basket. Just look at the social phenomenon of Chavs!

Have been with the missus for eight years now, had the Thai ceremony only, so, not "officially" married, though will do that soon because of the visa benefits.
As I remarked in my first post, I was an active monger from the age of 22 to 39. I got very, very bored of it. A case of "been there, done that and have loads of T-shirts to prove it".
Actually, I love my wife to bits and I know that the feeling is mutual, so, no, I don't partake in the girls anymore. If I did decide to, I wouldn't do it in Phuket. "Never sh1t on your own doorstep" is a good saying.
I do get down to the bars in Bangla about once a week to indulge in my favourite hobby of people-watching. Just love watching all the action. But at the end of the day I go back to a loving wife who can put many of the girls to shame in the eye-candy department. I'm one hell of a lucky guy, and I wouldn't want to fcuk that up.

[fun2have]

top notch and what those of us mere visitors and lovers of los are only starting to learn.

[senor123]

Originally Posted by Sir Burr

7. Never sacrifice your future for the present. There are two types of farang that live in Thailand. Those that will be here for as long as they want, and those that will be forced home through lack of money. I have had close friends that have had to go back to the UK after staying in Phuket for twelve years or more. Once they are back, they don't adjust well.
It takes an awful lot of money to stay in Phuket. Don't sell up the home and make the permanent move to Thailand. If you fail and have to go home, at best you will have a big hole in your CV which employers don't like; at worst you will be too old to get a good job. Getting old is bad enough, being old AND poor is unthinkable. Better to keep making money in your home country and retire here when you have enough. US$400,000 would be the absolute minimum.
.

Hullo Sir Burr,
Are you talking about having US$400k cash invested somewhere or held as readies in a bank in Thailand or a bank in another country.
I am very interested in knowing how you derived that figure.
Steve

[LivinLOS]

invested and working for you..

Depending on age I would consider that a MINIMUM !!!!

[Werwolf]

Hi Sir Burr,
I only can agree to the others.
Realy great post and intersting points.
.. and I agree with point no 9

[Sir Burr]

If you are not married to a Thai, you will need to show an income of 800,000 Baht per year to qualify for your retirement visa. This works out at 66,666 Baht per month. I think you will agree that this is not a great amount of money.

If you are retired, your assets (in another country) should be as safe as possible, making income (not in the stock market). To stay on the safe side, I think you can only garauntee a return of 5% a year.

At an exchange rate of 40 Bt to US$1, then 800,000 Bt is = US$20,000.

If US$20,000 is equal to 5% of investment, then you need US$400,000.

If you are older, say in you fifties and have nobody to look after, after you die; then you won't need as much because you can start spending the principal ie. spend your last dollar on your coffin.

[Mav]

Welcome to the Board

Good to have another experienced LOS resident to pass on their knowledge.

[LivinLOS]

Actually SB its 800k for a OA retirement visa.. its 400k for a marriage visa.. Thats per year or monthly equivalent or combo of the two...

[Sir Burr]

Originally Posted by LivinLOS

Actually SB its 800k for a OA retirement visa.. its 400k for a marriage visa.. Thats per year or monthly equivalent or combo of the two...

LivinLOS - Yeah, that's why I'll officially marry the missus soon. For the Non-immigrant O and only having to show 400,000. Though saying that, I'm aiming for a retirement income of 80,000 Bht per month. Don't have to pay rent as I own my house.

[khon kaen boy]

SB when are you officially getting married then ? as I done it this year in BKK and it only took two hours, no Bullsh*t, on valentine's day...it did cost a little bit more, but all above board as registered at British Embassy so marriage is legal back in UK.
What I'm trying to say if you are interested I will drop you number & address of Thai lawyer when I get back to KK next month.

BTW he has an old fashioned typewriter and when he was typing everything (rapidly) he was talking away to me with clunk, clunk ching and all that, I'm thinking I'll need to check these forms surely can't be right but hey fair play to the wee guy not one mistake.

I had to tell him his sign in the window was misleading as said

"ALIEN MARRIAGE HERE"

phone home ET

[Sir Burr]

Thanks for the offer KK Boy, but haven't a clue when it will happen. Am going to let the missus arrange it all. Will be low key, just the two of us turning up at the Umpur to sign a bit of paper. We both consider that we are married already, so this is just to get me a few benefits. Don't know if I'll bother registering it at the British embassy, it might pay me not to, just in case everything goes t1ts-up (not that I think it will).
My missus comes from a village an hour away from KK. Have even toyed with the idea of moving there when I finally retire (KK, not the village...no way!).

[marc26]

sir burr,
what have you done for a livign all these years?

[Jack]

Hello Sir

You have posted a very wise statement, 90% of which I agree with. Perhaps the exception is when you mention the aging problem...i.e. that Thai ladies will not be so interested in oldsters except for their dough. Well, I agree that dough is important but that's not everything.

As a 68 year old, I usually have no trouble with relationships with young ladies.Right now I'm after a beautiful 21 year old Bangkok college student who doesn't even take a drink. Met her in a Soi 33 bar where she started as a hostess a month ago. Great personality...she will go out to a dinner/disco but not sleep with clients....at least not me. I seek a platonic relationship with her....for now at least.

The point is that at 68 you are not necessarily over the hill if you have good health and keep active with sports and stuff. I haven't even thought of retirement yet...even though, yes, that would give me more time down in my Phuket home.

Don't worry about aging. Its not a bad as one might think. For example, I can brief you on many of the island discos (including those in Phuket Town) and a lot of them in Bangkok.