Charts

[Drive]

I don't invest in shares anymore after I had my fingers burned in the late eighties bull market and subsequent stock market crash.Back then I loved to buy penny shares and chart their progress.I'd buy the financial times everyday and plot their movement on my own moving average charts.I think the last time I was tempted to enter the market was after the tech stock bubble burst a few years ago,there were bargains to be had amongst good companies that suffered because of the general sector sentiment and with hindsight that was a good time to pick up stocks.I'd be interested to hear if anyone else uses charts and if so are there any good websites they know of providing charts,I used to use Bloomberg alot but find their charts don't go back far enough.If you're not a chartist,how do you make your investment decisions?

[K2]

I'll refrain from saying to much here ... however since I've been a technical (chart) trader for 20 years proabably down my street to add some pointers.

Bloomberg (for me) is the best financial package around but as a private investor a bit on the expensive side.

Nearly all online stock brokers have chart packages included (most are free as well).

Even yahoo and google provide free charts of varying quaility - just type in google search for free charts on what ever stock etc you want to look at. Unless you are trading for ultralong term than history back to 1985 is enough.

I feel fairly strongly about giving investment advice on public forums - I dont know anything about your risk appitite or investment objectives - so seek out professional advice.

[Drive]

I wasn't looking for specific investment advice.I'm just interested in the different approaches people have to making investment decisions and the various merits of those methods.

[Bushdoctor]

I used to use worden brothers, they have great charts and also give limited advice, but it's a pay service. I just look at fundamentals now. Charts and me haven't done so well together.

[PeterG]

try here

Incredible Charts: Stock Trading Guide - Stocks and Shares

download and use of delayed data for free with many things to play around.
Pretty good stuff to analyse stocks and indizes and all for free.

[Lag00n]

K2

Do you use wave analysis, market profile or indicators for your analysis?

Did the China sell off hit the thai exchange hard last week?

[Lag00n]

For good free charts that cover most exchanges have a look at www big charts .com (no spaces)

[K2]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

K2

Do you use wave analysis, market profile or indicators for your analysis?

Did the China sell off hit the thai exchange hard last week?

Yes - I use Eliot wave analysis primarily.

Market profile is useful for day trading and I was fortunate enough to be tought by Steidlmayer himself.

I'm not a big fan of momentum indicators as they all pretty much do the same thing. I dont enjoy trending markets much - rather focus my short term efforts on volatile choppy markets.

The China sell off had modest impact on SET - down around 5%. (Bear in mind SET p/e is ~ 10 whereas China is closer to 25).

[Lag00n]

Originally Posted by K2

Yes - I use Eliot wave analysis primarily.

Market profile is useful for day trading and I was fortunate enough to be tought by Steidlmayer himself.

I'm not a big fan of momentum indicators as they all pretty much do the same thing. I dont enjoy trending markets much - rather focus my short term efforts on volatile choppy markets.

The China sell off had modest impact on SET - down around 5%. (Bear in mind SET p/e is ~ 10 whereas China is closer to 25).

K2

I am a trend follower myself, I am planing to look at wave and Gann techniques but i say, there a whole new world.

Market profile also interests me a lot, your so lucky to have been taught by Steidlmayer did you do a work shop with him or you know him personally?

I try to keep in very simple and only use one indicator OBV with Volume and trend lines.

Your where I hope to be just looking at the trend and it cycles or pivot points.

I think China gave the US, Europe and Australia the reason it was looking for to have a correction that was well due.

U say just trade short term on volatile markets is that so you can make a steady daily/weekly income? What markets are you trading if you don't mind me asking?

[K2]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

K2

I am a trend follower myself, I am planing to look at wave and Gann techniques but i say, there a whole new world.

I spent a fair bit of time on Gann analysis - ultimately I abandoned it as was not reliable enough and/or I prefered Eliot Wave.

Market profile also interests me a lot, your so lucky to have been taught by Steidlmayer did you do a work shop with him or you know him personally?

Did a workshop with him at his ranch in 1990 - got to know him then.

I try to keep in very simple and only use one indicator OBV with Volume and trend lines.

Your where I hope to be just looking at the trend and it cycles or pivot points.

If your a trend follower then MA's will serve you as well as anything, would suggest based on my observations of successful trend followers to keep things a simple as possible and stay out of non-trending choppy sideways markets after trend reversals.

I think China gave the US, Europe and Australia the reason it was looking for to have a correction that was well due.

In part, main driver is the unwind of the JPY carry trade (borrow JPY at 0.25-050%) to fund taking positions in higher yeilding riskier trades - it all been good - until now - now the exit is very small - hence the sharp sell off. China was a trigger for this move that agreed is long overdue.

U say just trade short term on volatile markets is that so you can make a steady daily/weekly income? What markets are you trading if you don't mind me asking?

Mainly FX, but anything that charts and has liquidity is of interest to me.

Answers in blue. Happy Trading All.

[Rex7777]

Although technical analysis makes some sense to me, I've never had the discipline to actually trade based strictly on technical indicators.

Looking back, I've been pretty good at picking stocks for the long term. Unfortunately for me, I haven't always had the patience to actually hold those stocks for the long term. Just one example: I bought a bunch of Apple computer stock in the summer of 1985 (when it looked like the company was going down the tubes). Anyway, after a 10X increase, I decided not to be greedy and sold it all. In retrospect, that was a stupid thing to do. Other times, with other stocks, I've often been spooked by short term fluctuations, selling at a loss or with only a small gain.

I've tried to learn from my mistakes, but those mistakes have sometimes been expensive.

Rex

[Lag00n]

Originally Posted by Rex7777

Although technical analysis makes some sense to me, I've never had the discipline to actually trade based strictly on technical indicators.

Looking back, I've been pretty good at picking stocks for the long term. Unfortunately for me, I haven't always had the patience to actually hold those stocks for the long term. Just one example: I bought a bunch of Apple computer stock in the summer of 1985 (when it looked like the company was going down the tubes). Anyway, after a 10X increase, I decided not to be greedy and sold it all. In retrospect, that was a stupid thing to do. Other times, with other stocks, I've often been spooked by short term fluctuations, selling at a loss or with only a small gain.

I've tried to learn from my mistakes, but those mistakes have sometimes been expensive.

Rex

Dont beat yourself up to much Rex,

If your still making a profit then your doing well.

some basic tech analysis, follow a monthy chart of the stock and draw in a long term trend line and follow that line till the stock breaks it. (there needs to be two or more points touching the line to make it a trend)

But I suggest you buy some books on technical analysis.

[Lag00n]

Originally Posted by K2

Answers in blue. Happy Trading All.

Thanks for the reply K2

I do use a simple 21 period MA but that is mostly for looks and short term trend health. i buy in once a correction has stopped and hold till it breaks its trend line on the weekly time frame.

Use OBV with volume to give me a entry it is working very well on the current bull markets running at the moment. But I am always try to keep evolving in my trading.

I would love to know the price tag of the market profile seminar you went too, but I could imagine it would have already paid for it's self!

I just had a great run on the XJO Aussie200 contract and on the DOW.

Now just have to wait for the sellers to do there thing and look for a new entry.

FOREX is somthing I have never looked at. I myself think its very fundermently driven and it can change direction very quickly thats a main reason it's not attractive to my trading style right now.

K2, do you trade over the commodities markets?

[K2]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

But I suggest you buy some books on technical analysis.

IMO only one book (that I've read so far on Technical Analysis .. in 20 years) is worth the money for cover to cover value : John J. Murphy 'Technical Analysis of the Futures Market' ISBN 01389800X

Read Chapter 16 on Money Management first.

[Lag00n]

Read Chapter 16 on Money Management first.

Rex that is the best advice anyone could give you in regards to trading!

As I have heard a lot, Trading is not about making money its about managing money!

REX, cuz K2 advised a book I will chuck one in as well.

I read Stan Weinstein's Secrets For Profiting in Bull and Bear Markets.
some good basic techniques and strategies. But it is quite old now.


K2
Thanks for the book title I will look at getting it.

[K2]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

I do use a simple 21 period MA but that is mostly for looks and short term trend health. i buy in once a correction has stopped and hold till it breaks its trend line on the weekly time frame.

Use OBV with volume to give me a entry it is working very well on the current bull markets running at the moment. But I am always try to keep evolving in my trading.

[colour=blue] Everyone has to find a trading style/methodology that suits them - sometimes it can take a real test of nerves to stick with you own proven methodology. For me I'm far better at trading volatile choppy markets - perhaps from my FX background. Long term stock trading (buy and hold) while highly profitable long term does not suit me - so I leave that to those who are very proficient at it. [/color]

I would love to know the price tag of the market profile seminar you went too, but I could imagine it would have already paid for it's self!

Was paid for by the bank I was working for and yes paid for itself many many times over - as I last heard Peter himself has stopped running courses - Mike Quanbeck took over for a while and I think one of Peters kids now holds seminars - his daugther was a great trader at ~17 when I was at Butte Meadows.

I just had a great run on the XJO Aussie200 contract and on the DOW.

Now just have to wait for the sellers to do there thing and look for a new entry.

FOREX is somthing I have never looked at. I myself think its very fundermently driven and it can change direction very quickly thats a main reason it's not attractive to my trading style right now.

Always great to know what you enjoy trading and what you dont - saves a LOT of money in the long run and every market always has opportunities.

K2, do you trade over the commodities markets?

Yes - but because of the high volitity position size needs reducing to meet my risk control and the relative illiquidity and short market hours (or downright bizzare hours like at the LME) make commodities low on priority list. Gold and Oil I monitor closely.

More answers in blue.

[Lag00n]

Was paid for by the bank I was working for and yes paid for itself many many times over - as I last heard Peter himself has stopped running courses - Mike Quanbeck took over for a while and I think one of Peters kids now holds seminars - his daugther was a great trader at ~17 when I was at Butte Meadows.

That is the great advantage of being a professional trader, your employer wants you to be the best you can be!

I could not imagin it a 17 yar old girl giving all of these middle age guys advice!

Would love to see her at a seminar, the first look on all the atendees faces would be priceless

Always great to know what you enjoy trading and what you dont - saves a LOT of money in the long run and every market always has opportunities.

yes that is very true!

Yes - but because of the high volitity position size needs reducing to meet my risk control and the relative illiquidity and short market hours (or downright bizzare hours like at the LME) make commodities low on priority list. Gold and Oil I monitor closely.

Once the bull run in the share markets comes to a end I will move to the futures markets, one thing I noticed looking at the futures markets is there is always somthing thats on a medium / long term uptrend! Please correct me if that is a false statement.


Replies in Grey

I am off for the day, see you on the boards tomorrow K2

[K2]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

Was paid for by the bank I was working for and yes paid for itself many many times over - as I last heard Peter himself has stopped running courses - Mike Quanbeck took over for a while and I think one of Peters kids now holds seminars - his daugther was a great trader at ~17 when I was at Butte Meadows.

That is the great advantage of being a professional trader, your employer wants you to be the best you can be!

I could not imagin it a 17 yar old girl giving all of these middle age guys advice!

She certainly had my respect - all our real P&L's were open for all to see ... this was 12 years ago, so shes probably done very well I hope.

Would love to see her at a seminar, the first look on all the atendees faces would be priceless

Always great to know what you enjoy trading and what you dont - saves a LOT of money in the long run and every market always has opportunities.

yes that is very true!

Yes - but because of the high volitity position size needs reducing to meet my risk control and the relative illiquidity and short market hours (or downright bizzare hours like at the LME) make commodities low on priority list. Gold and Oil I monitor closely.

[color="Gray"]Once the bull run in the share markets comes to a end Um I think can proabably say the short term trend is now definitely negative I will move to the futures markets, one thing I noticed looking at the futures markets is there is always somthing thats on a medium / long term uptrend! Please correct me if that is a false statement. Yes in geral and if looking at a braod enough range of instruments. In general bonds will rally when stocks plunge - flight to quality; but there are - albeit rare occasions - where everything pukes/rallies]


Replies in Grey

I am off for the day, see you on the boards tomorrow K2

Have a good evening Lag00n - Asia down ~ 4% .... going to be a long day.

[Robaht]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

I read Stan Weinstein's Secrets For Profiting in Bull and Bear Markets.
some good basic techniques and strategies. But it is quite old now.


.

I recommend Stan's book as well. While I am surprised he never updated it, the fundamentals are clearly explained. I must admit he lost me a bit toward the end of the book (at least my interest in what he was talking about), but I go back from time to time to re-read the first 2/3 of the book. I also liked the Reminiscences of a Stock Operator book, which talks about speculation in the 1920's era -- but the lessons are timeless and a little freaky when you see yourself in what he is writing.

Final rec, if anyone is interested, for stockcharts.com has a lot of useful information and their real-time stock charts (subscription required) are really good if you like to daytrade but don't want to spend a fortune on bloomberg.

Cheers, Robaht

[Lag00n]

Hi K2,

How have things been?

well the sell off was very tame compared to what i thought it could have been but I am not 100% sure we are out of the woods yet.

Have been looking to buy the book you recommended.

Found this book in OZ Technical Analysis of the Financial Markets: A Comprehensive Guide to Trading Methods and Applications is it as good as the one you advised to get?

love when these bounces occur it is real heart in the mouth stuff to go long!

[LivinLOS]

I personally think theres plenty of carry trade unwinding all lining up to happen.. falling US rates look to worry that crowd..

I fully expect PM's and PM stocks to get caught in the downdraft again but will remain long..

[K2]

Originally Posted by Lag00n

Found this book in OZ Technical Analysis of the Financial Markets: A Comprehensive Guide to Trading Methods and Applications is it as good as the one you advised to get?

You omitted to say who the author is for you book - it it John J. Murphy - then thats the one.

Amazon.com: Technical Analysis of the Financial Markets: A Comprehensive Guide to Trading Methods and Applications (New York Institute of Finance): Books: John J. Murphy

Move down met minimum correction (5%) criteria but was very short lived.

I am open minded at the moment - I think there are problems but the speed of recovery shows me this market is strong and after trying to pick he top which was expensive and unadvisable - currently sitting on the sidelines.

The dollar has resumed its downward track and as LiL mentions the carry trade (borrow JOY to fund higher risk trades) has huge potential to trouble hedge funds down the road. (That too has recovered very quickly).

Lets see what the Fed does tonight - expectation is for no change on rates, but see what the wording of the statement is.